Why Change Hasn't Worked in the Past | Ep. 10

Dane: [00:00]
It was 1996., and I ran the L. A. Marathon. And I didn't run for two years after, the marathon was done. I was interested in the finite game, I won.

Dane: [00:10]
But then the thing was done. I didn't have any ambition of becoming a runner.

Dane: [00:15]
When it's just a big leap. It gets you to where you see dramatic results in a very short period of time. And then without strategy after that moment, it breaks down very, very quickly. That's the bummer, it doesn't take into consideration what happens at the end of the finite constraint. So it's awesome until it's not.

Dane: [00:34]
I think where people get themselves into trouble is when they try to get something out of these options that they weren't designed to, to offer. It's not about like what's the right and wrong option. It's the right option is the option that is going to deliver on the thing that you're looking for

Dane: [00:48]
as humans we prefer the path of least resistance. We crave convenience, the payoff without the price. But when our lives revolve around comfort, it doesn't deliver. Living in perpetual comfort leaves us weak and asleep. This podcast is an invitation to flip that script, to choose the unlikely path, to get the life you really want through voluntary discomfort.

Dane: [01:13]
This is Strong and Awake. I'm Dane Sanders.

Mitch: [01:17]
Hey, Dane. Hey, Mitch.

Mitch: [01:19]
Let's get into it Let's talk about options and promises, especially at the time of this recording We're, you know approaching the end of the year possibilities for change. Um, there's just so many options out there, uh, and we're wading through all of it. I thought it would be helpful to have a conversation. And I'm curious about those options, especially as it relates to kind of our own growth, our own transformation, the life that we're, we're living.

Dane: [01:48]
So you're talking about is the vehicles by which we consciously or unconsciously want to get like the cars you want to get on, get into that are going to take us to, to the promised land to change to transformation to the, to the, to the selves that we wish we were. Absolutely. Absolutely. Well, there's a lot of options out there.

Dane: [02:10]
There are, there's more than a couple and they all have a bunch of promises. And, and I think before we get started, I think it's worth mentioning upfront that even though we'll no doubt talk about options that people choose regularly, the purpose of this is to not make people feel bad. These options actually, uh, are effective for what they were built to deliver.

Dane: [02:33]
I think where people get themselves into trouble is when they try to get something out of these options that they weren't designed to, to offer. So I think it's important to say that upfront because when you do, it's, it's not about like what's the right and wrong option. It's the, the, the right option is the option that is going to deliver on the thing that you're looking for and getting clear on if, what do you want and will this help me get what I want?

Dane: [02:58]
That's really the question. So I hope by the end of this conversation. At the least we've gotten clarity around the options that are out there and what they promise because of how they're designed. And, and I hope we look at these a little bit more beyond, beyond just the marketing of these tools, but actually the efficacy of these tools.

Dane: [03:20]
And then the other side of it, I hope is we upgrade what people want. That's what I would love to see happen at the end of this conversation, that all of us begin to envision like Hey, Uh, a result that's, uh, uh, up into the right around who we're becoming, not just self improvement, but actually becoming more ourselves and, and then pick the appropriate means to become that.

Dane: [03:47]
Uh, and see, see if it, see if this conversation doesn't help with the upgrade of that conversation for yourself.

Mitch: [03:53]
Mm. So, so what are those? I mean, I can think of so many different. Um, things that I have done or that I see others doing around me to, to get to that promise land, like you said, to become that person or even maybe before that, to just get the things that I want.

Mitch: [04:10]
Right. Yeah. What are, what are the, I mean, I'm sure anyone that's watching or listening to this can think of. 10 things off the top of their head right now that they tried in this last year.

Dane: [04:19]
They're gonna, they're gonna predict the things we, we mentioned because they're so, they're tropes. I mean, they're like, we, they're so everywhere.

Dane: [04:26]
And, uh, but let's name them and kind of x ray them a little bit. So the obvious one, I think we should probably start with our new year's resolutions. I mean, we're coming up on a new year, new year, new you. Um, it's, it's, uh, there's so many, um, Things that are going to be marketed as that. And I think that it's almost like a genre of transformation or change that people are looking for.

Dane: [04:58]
And I, the classic one is like, I'm going to lose weight, you know, I'm going to eat better. I'm going to, um, I'm going to get to the gym. And the one, you know, the, the, the organization I like to both affirm and pick on. are like the planet fitnesses of the world, right? There's a reason why they, they market on the rock and Eve, you know, New Year's 10, 9, 8, 7, 6, freezing in the cold in New York city.

Dane: [05:23]
Um, and there's purple and yellow, I think posters everywhere of planet fitness and it's a dollar a month. You can get in for a dollar a month. This is incredible. Like how can they make money on 12 a year? Well, they can make money because even with a finite amount of gyms, Uh, they, they will be full for three weeks.

Dane: [05:45]
This is what we all know. And, and we've talked about this in the past, why these things break down. We won't get into that right now. But I think it's worth noting the good things about New Year's resolutions like Planet Fitness or whatever it is that you sign up for is that it starts the conversation.

Dane: [06:01]
It's, it, it, it initiates. It, it at least kind of sets an intention. I want this. And I want to move in this direction. It's, it's kind of a. A provisional commitment where if everything lines up, this is going to happen. And uh, we'll talk more about that nuance and I'm sure in a few minutes, but the, um, I think the main thing is to understand what the category is that we're talking about first and then break down what is it, what is the promise?

Dane: [06:26]
The promise is that if you have a new year's resolution, you have a chance of change. And if you've done this for enough years in a row and you realize that the same new year's resolution keeps coming up over and over and over again. , um, there's something that you're expecting from making a New Year's resolution.

Dane: [06:43]
That New Year's resolutions on their own are insufficient to deliver. Uh, but mm-hmm. It does bring attention. It brings kind of hope, kind of the sense of clarity, uh, ish and I. I remember one, uh, experience I had, this is where it really came to light for me. I was a young dad and I was, I was at a Starbucks on an early, on a New Year's day.

Dane: [07:11]
And, um, I was journaling, you know, cause everyone starts journaling in New Year's and, you know, and, uh, and the barista was the one who confronted me, who basically flippantly said like, Oh, coming up in these resolutions, you could just like, go back 365 days in your journal that has all those empty pages and realize you wrote the same thing last year.

Dane: [07:31]
And I was, I was like,

Dane: [07:38]
there it is again. And you can go back a lot of years if you keep your journals. And, um, again, I don't want to make New Year's resolutions bad. They're good. They're just, they're, they're insufficient. They're often necessary but insufficient for what I think people are really craving. So that's probably where I'd start with New Year's resolutions.

Dane: [07:57]
What comes to mind for you?

Mitch: [07:58]
Yeah, for me, I mean, it's closely related to New Year's resolutions, but it's, you know, whether it's a dry January or this new race that I want to Product placement. Yeah, for those that are watching, Dane's holding up one of our I got, I got one here too. You know, got to represent.

Mitch: [08:23]
Uh, yeah, but closely related to news resolutions is this, like these challenges, these big leaps, like now is the time, like I'm going to do it. I'm going to do the whole 30. I'm going to cut out alcohol for a month. Um, whatever it is. And like looking to that as, I think oftentimes, like when, when they work and they, they can be really great is, you know, as some kind of like reset or helping you realize and expand your, your capacity for what you can actually do by giving yourself that finite window of time.

Mitch: [08:57]
But oftentimes they have failed for me when they remain just that. Yeah. A finite window of time. And then I go back to wherever I was at before. Even worse.

Dane: [09:11]
Yeah. Well, let's, let's talk about that. Cause I, I think this is where it's helpful to make a distinction between what you're describing the big leap in a new year's resolution and that they often, often happen in January, but there is a distinction.

Dane: [09:22]
One is you're saying out loud, I resolved to have a new thing. And the assumption in that is it's going to be, that's the new normal, right? That's the new normal you want, starting with the resolve. And that's different than, I like the intention behind it. I want something to persist. That's where the news, but it fails after the start with the news resolution.

Dane: [09:44]
With the big leaps, and let's pick on, uh, 75 hard, uh, which is, for those who don't know, it's this, um, very rigorous 75 day, Uh, prescription of what you ought to do. And it's funny. We, at men and women of discomfort, we get compared a lot to 75 hard and we're very distinct. Uh, we look a lot similar, uh, but there's a very different intention because of exactly what you're describing Mitch is.

Dane: [10:10]
Uh, and anyone who's listening will know the answer to this question right away. What do you think happens? Let's say you change your diet and work out twice a day and, and do all these things and you don't miss a day and you're, You're ruthless. If you miss one day, you start over and 71 days goes back to day one and you find your way all the way to day 75.

Dane: [10:31]
What do you think happens on day 76? Everyone knows the answer. The wheels come off. You're done. Victory! You pass that finish line. And, uh, I remember the first time I ran a marathon. I was gonna run a marathon. And it was 1996. And I ran the L. A. Marathon. And I didn't run for two years after the marathon was done because I, I I was interested in the, the confined constraint of like, I did this, that, you know, the finite game I won.

Dane: [11:04]
And then I didn't have any ambition of becoming someone, of becoming a runner. That wasn't my ambition. I actually became a runner for a short window of time, but then the thing was done. And, and this is the big criticism of, of the big leaps is when it's just a big leap. Um, it, it gets you to where you, oftentimes you see dramatic results in a very short period of time.

Dane: [11:28]
And then, um, without anything, no, no strategy after that moment, uh, it breaks down very, very quickly. And, and to your point where it gets tragic is you see people do whole 30, for example, I've done whole 30 gazillion times.

Dane: [11:44]
I love it. It's actually part of my process, uh, practice. Um, and. Uh, whole thirties, uh, I, I know a lot of people who have more weight on, they, they, they lose 30 or 40 pounds and then they gain 40 or 50 pounds within a year.

Dane: [12:00]
And that's the bummer is it doesn't take into consideration what happens at the end of the finite constraint. So it's awesome until it's not. And that's, that's, that's what you need to account for. Uh, if you want something that will persist beyond the constrained time. What's required is a plan for day seven, the metaphorical day 76.

Mitch: [12:22]
Yeah. When you, when you, when we're talking about big leaps, you know, the, I'm sure when people are envisioning an actual physical leap, they're envisioning, you know, the, the super Mario, like jumping over a gap or something like that. But oftentimes with these big leaps, it's not like a, a linear forward progression.

Mitch: [12:38]
It's almost just like a, you're jumping straight up.

Mitch: [12:40]
Yeah. Yeah. Gained elevation. I'm climbing. And then it's like straight down. Oh, that's so good. What a great metaphor. You know, uh, you know, going up a slope or something where you've got something under you.

Mitch: [12:52]
Well, it's funny if you want to really want to pick on that metaphor, isn't there something in, in Super Mario and all the different Mario versions where You get like the big Mario jumping and going faster and doing the thing.

Mitch: [13:04]
And then it like steps on a mushroom or something. And all of a sudden it goes, wah, wah, wah, wah. And it's like this big.

Mitch: [13:10]
Yeah. Mushrooms are the good, the good things, but yes. Right. Yes.

Dane: [13:15]
Yes. Uh, and, and I think that's, that sadly that happens quicker than we prefer. Um, so. So, uh, buyer beware, um, on the big leap and, and, uh, do your due diligence that the big leap has a, has a plan on the other side of the leap.

Dane: [13:35]
And, uh, and, and that is a plan that you actually are committed to. Um, but you know, the big leaps are kind of, if you think New Year's resolution big leaps, if you think of a big leap as a massive challenge. You know, that's what, uh, an option that people kind of consider. And I actually like that. I like the idea.

Dane: [13:56]
If you're going to have a bias in the culture that we live in right now, this highly comfort centric culture, um, it's probably better than the alternative, which is, um, if, if that's hyper challenge, uh, hyper support and hyper support is an option that's on the table. And it's particularly effective. in the context of trauma in people's lives, uh, in the context of, of involuntary discomforts that come your way, gaining some sense of support.

Dane: [14:27]
I think of like, um, uh, it could be as As, uh, psychologically complex as, as, you know, psychoanalysis or therapy or counseling, all of those are different kinds. And within psychology, there's, you know, hundreds of modalities that you can approach that work with, uh, with varying degrees of efficacy relative to what you're trying to address.

Dane: [14:48]
Um, and you're, you know, the, the practitioner you're working with and your disposition and, and personality and, and capacity in the midst of it, there's a lot that goes into these dynamics. Um, yeah. external forces as you're navigating it. Uh, that's on the kind of psychologically more extreme end. Um, all the way down to like, I'm going to go for a spa day.

Dane: [15:10]
Uh, I'm going to, I'm going to let myself off the hook on my diet. I'm going to, um, uh, when my body tells me it wants chocolate at 10 PM and a bowl cereal, I give it to my body because my body wants it, you know? And, and, uh, it's just like some, weird declaration of like, I'm going to give into my indulgences and somehow that's going to get me what I'm really looking for.

Dane: [15:37]
And, and to be fair, comfort or hedonism, really the pursuit of pleasure and the avoidance of pain is, um, highly effective in the short term. It's amazing. You know, um, have five cocktails. You're going to feel better while you're drinking the five cocktails. It's just on the other side of the five cocktails.

Dane: [15:59]
Uh, you're dehydrated, you have a headache, you haven't drunk much recently, thank goodness, but now you've drunk a lot, you get sick, you wake up feeling horrible, the next day is awful, you maybe give in to, maybe go to another spa day, you know, and these things start cycling down in the wrong direction, really drifting.

Dane: [16:18]
And if you pour, if you pour gas on that thing, it'll go even faster. I'm mixing all my metaphors again, but you get the point. It's simply, all of these. Supports are, are, are, are increasing the pace of the drift and it's taking us places. We all know universally too much support leads to stagnation at the least, but demise at the worst.

Dane: [16:43]
Uh, we just, it's, it's just, relief, faster, quicker, no pain. like, you know, why do people get addicted to painkillers? Um, because it feels good, man. It does. Uh, until it doesn't. And, uh, my wife's cousin, um, passed away, uh, in a, uh, behind a Burger King, uh, after being homeless for about five years, living on the streets, addicted, like, so, you know, from heroin to Oxycontin to, Um, all the drugs in between and, uh, none of it started that way.

Dane: [17:25]
None of it started that way and it never does, right? And I'm not trying to suggest that, gosh, pick pleasures and that you're going to live in it and your life in a ditch. What I am saying though is if that's all your life is about, it will drift to bad things a hundred percent of the time and where I want to give exception to it and recognize the goodness of support.

Dane: [17:47]
Um, Hyper support even is under, under radical duress. Like if you, if you are, um, under, under the bus of the world and you need some degree of relief to get through the night, do it, do it. But just recognize that in the morning something, It's going to work. You're going to need something in the, in the challenge side of the equation, not just the support side of the equation.

Dane: [18:17]
If you want to see change and growth, not just because what we're talking about, the good side of comfort is really, um, being comforted when you are undone, uh, as a means to survive in the short term, in order to get to a place of traction where you can start building again. Our, you're not gonna become someone new by just giving into comforts and hyper support.

Dane: [18:42]
Like, why is there massive chronic obesity in our culture? Well, this is the result of people choosing hyper support exclusively.

Mitch: [18:51]
Mm-Hmm. . Mm-Hmm. .

Dane: [18:52]
And, uh, and it's tragic. Um, and, and I, I have great compassion 'cause there's so much. cultural pressure to pick the easy way.

Dane: [19:01]
And the easy way is really about selling things to you more than it is about you getting better or getting more whole or get becoming more yourself. So that's the option. So what, so we have, we have, um, New Year's resolutions. We have leaps, the big leaps, hyper, hyper challenge. And then we have hyper support.

Dane: [19:24]
Um, and for all the good that those things do, they're, they're phenomenal. But there are other options, too. What would be another one that we could address that comes to mind?

Mitch: [19:32]
Yeah, I mean, I think along with those things comes just the, the wishful thinking. If all the stars align, then I'll do this. This kind of comes back to resolutions and why they fail almost.

Mitch: [19:46]
Yeah. We tell ourselves, well, when I get, when I get here, then I'll do this. Or, you know, this is my intention without any kind of plan. It's that, it's that, yeah, the, the, the stars align strategy. Um, which isn't much of a strategy as any of us that have tried that. Uh, we'll soon find out.

Dane: [20:05]
And we've all tried it, right?

Dane: [20:06]
There's a, there's a sense of like, you know, that it's a, it's a, it's a trope and in a boardroom to say, Hey guys, hope isn't a strategy. And uh, it's because without any kind of material committed action that pushes in the opposite direction of the cultural drift that we're all living in, there's no chance for you to create the appropriate tension that's required for growth to happen.

Dane: [20:32]
If there is no tension. there is no growth. It's, it's proven in study after study, after study, after study, you, your job is to get to a place of healthy tension without getting to a place of toxic, um, compression, or like, I only want to call it like toxic stress, uh, as opposed to healthy compression. And, and it's, uh, you know, you're, you're calibrating all the dials all the time.

Dane: [20:58]
Uh, if you're going to play this game of becoming and growth and being aware of kind of the season that you're in and what you're navigating and what's available to you and where ought, where's the room for challenge and where is there need for support? All those things I think are critical to consider all the time.

Dane: [21:14]
You gotta be awake. through this kind of a process. But what we definitely know is that no one in the history of time has drifted their way into the good life. Even, even people who, uh, they do nothing of ambition and they win the lottery. You know, the lottery is just such an interesting, extrinsic, tangible thing to point to and all the studies of people who, uh, win the lottery and where are they within five years?

Dane: [21:43]
Like it's. Okay. And it's, it's on everyone. I don't have to finish the sentence and everyone listening knows exactly what I'm talking about. Like they've they're painless again. Well, well, well, what happened? How could that be true? It was so much money. And uh, because cause all that extrinsic, um, fortune presents as an amplification of what current reality was, it just, it's just going to.

Dane: [22:07]
So if I have a really poor lifestyle and I come into a bunch of money, my poor lifestyle will be amplified. And whatever that, that poor lifestyle used to give me, at least with limited means, now I just poured fuel on it. And now, some people have way worse lives.

Dane: [22:23]
And it's not just mo money, mo problems.

Dane: [22:24]
It's mo money in the context of, of not having any strategy at all to navigate the drift of life. That's the challenge. And it's also why I think there's such a understandable move towards things like minimalism. And, you know, people, when people who've tried a bunch of different options for change and they can't find anything, they just go like, I'm just going to make my life as small as possible because at least that'll slow down things.

Dane: [22:49]
And it, it does, it does, but it often doesn't take new ground. It actually, it's minimalism is best set to set the table to increase challenge in a way that's sustainable over time. Um, but left, left on its own. There's. There's, um, I want to say low likelihood, but it's not even low likelihood. There's zero likelihood that you're going to become someone new because you didn't do anything.

Dane: [23:13]
Um, unless somehow there's some zap that happens.

Mitch: [23:18]
So we've gone over the resolutions, the promises, um, The big leaps, hyper challenge, hyper support, wishful thinking,

Mitch: [23:26]
I suppose there's like one more thing. And, uh, and this is, If I just had fill in the blank. Yeah. If I just had that rogue power cage. If I just had this course. I just bought this book.

Dane: [23:42]
Did you check my search? Were you looking at my search history? Over Black Friday? Yeah, that's right.

Dane: [23:47]
That's right. And, and, and gosh, are we being promised a lot of those, those, you know, if I only had the gear. One of my favorite stories of this is, um, we were having a yard sale years and years ago. And, um, Uh, a friend of mine came up, amazing athlete that's in the side by the way, and he told a story about how, uh, he, uh, one of his previous garage sales, he, um, had a neighbor who is, uh, grossly obese and had a, uh, some fancy magic machine that doesn't matter which machine it was.

Dane: [24:17]
Just if the machine, you know, the machine, he saw the ad, probably a late night infomercial or whatever it was, and he got the machine. And, uh, and it was one of those popular machines, like, and, um, my friend who went up to him and, uh, said, Oh, wow, it's pretty good. How much? And he says the price. Oh, my gosh, it's a great price.

Dane: [24:38]
Does it work? And the guy looked at his body up and down and, you know, an extra 180 pounds that needed to be there. And he goes, Are you kidding? Of course it works. Like, it's gonna, it's gonna deliver exactly what it does when it's by itself, when it's not moving, when no one's creating any tension with it.

Dane: [24:57]
Uh, and, and this, first of all, don't be a victim to the lies that, um, the thing will get you the thing, the thing won't. You on the thing, you with the thing, you creating the tension. The tools can be helpful if you work the tools, but the tools on their own are inanimate objects that are lifeless and have no power.

Dane: [25:16]
So you're the power. So, uh, you want to get in shape, don't get an e bike, get a bike. Uh, like you need the tension, you know? And, um, but if you want to have fun, go for a ride, it's called me bike. And, uh, I find funds funds fun. Who doesn't want fun? I mean, fun's great, but don't expect fun to get you to where you want to go.

Dane: [25:39]
So, uh, I'm a, And, and, and so all these things are related from a, from a marketing consumer perspective. The other, though, that I, I, I want to reference is just, um, really a more insidious thing, which is, uh, I'm a victim. You know, I don't have enough money to get in shape. I, you know, eating clean is too expensive.

Dane: [25:57]
Um, somehow it's, uh, you know, cheaper to go to Del Taco or something, you know, I'm not speaking to how hard life is. Life is hard and people are unreal under real financial pressures and time pressures and responsibility pressures. And I get all those things, which is all the more reason.

Dane: [26:14]
The more pressure you have in your life is why it's more critical than ever to have some area of your life that you have full agency over. That you are not a victim in, that no matter the circumstances, the whirlwind of being a human being, you find the immovable object in your life and you start moving forward with it.

Dane: [26:31]
And I'm a big fan of, uh, guys like James Clear and the way he talks about habit development and, uh, you know, all of the, means by which you can get some traction, some initial traction. For me, it started with flossing my teeth, uh, but it didn't stop there. And, uh, you, you know, you build on that over time, you know, day, week, a month, a quarter, a year, five years, 10 years, 20 years, all of a sudden you're like quicker than you think you can take tremendous ground, but it's, uh, It's, it has to happen from a sense of agency, from a sense of no matter the circumstances, no, how, no matter what's going on, I will find a way.

Dane: [27:14]
And if you can do that. If you can, like some minimally viable start, you, you can take ground. You just can't. But it's, it's, um, to just sit back and declare all the reasons why it's not going to happen. It's probably not very fruitful. No, no, it absolutely will never be fruitful. Um, you're under duress, you know, the world's falling down, your house is burnt down.

Dane: [27:41]
Uh, you know, everyone left you. I, yeah, take a minute, man. Life's hard. I get it. But just know that at some point that minute's got to end and you get to get after it again. And if you can manage to do that sooner than later, you're gonna be glad you did.

Mitch: [27:55]
So for the, for those that want to start taking ground now, like what's some homework that they can do again, equipped with this kind of labeling or this naming or acknowledging of these things that maybe we've done in the past.

Mitch: [28:11]
Like what can they do and how can they kind of leverage that into something that is actually kind of sustainable and will bring change?

Dane: [28:19]
What's probably important is to just do an honest audit of current reality. Like what, what are you currently up to? What's currently in the mix for you when you think about your life?

Dane: [28:28]
What have you tried? Like pull out a piece of this just right now. Pull out a piece of paper and, uh, and a pencil and start bulleting down. What have you, what do you, don't even go to what do you want? What have you tried to do? Because even what you try to do will probably reveal what you think you want if you're unclear on that.

Dane: [28:45]
I just don't want anyone to get stuck right now. I want people to very, very quickly iterate some semblance of like, these are the things I've tried and not to feel bad or shame or like, none of that. It's just, it's just, Probably, the things that we described today will offer explanatory power as to what those things gave you and what those, the limits were.

Dane: [29:07]
And if you can begin to kind of have a working sense of what that is, you're going to be much more empowered to make better decisions moving forward, to pick the right tool for the job. And that's what you want. And it's one of the reasons why we're going to spend the entire next episode talking about our tool, the men and women of discomfort community.

Dane: [29:26]
And the, there's, there's trade offs there too. We don't solve all problems, but we solve a very particular one and one that, uh, got pointed to in every single example of the other options that we referenced today. And I think if, if anyone has. As they do survey their life and they go, yeah, I've tried this and it wasn't really, it didn't deliver what I really wanted, or I still want something more, and I'm getting clearer and clearer about what I want, I don't, I think you, you don't want to miss the next episode, you just don't, uh, because we've done these same exercises, and it's, it's exactly how we have designed and continued to refine this community to deliver on a very unique promise that, that goes well beyond, uh, the tools that we represented today.

Dane: [30:11]
So. I hope I can't wait for that conversation. I wouldn't want to skip this step because the listeners and the folks that are listening are tuning in right now.

Dane: [30:18]
You're smart people. You've, you, you're not lazy. You've not, you've tried things and we recognize that. And we just wanted to offer some kind of working understanding as to why those things, what they did give you, but why they had gaps as well.

Dane: [30:35]
And then there's trade offs and with the awareness of that now. You're going to be in a much better position to make great choices. We just want to make sure that you include in your choices, at least one more option to consider.

Mitch: [30:48]
and again, not as this external promise of some magic. Secret sauce like it takes agency in the building cultivation of that, but that's exactly what we're, we're hoping and, uh, hoping to kind of equip you with and giving you a path forward.

Dane: [31:04]
That's right. It's a context by which you can actually get where you're looking for. Yeah. And, and, uh, but not without you. There's a reason why we say it's probably not for you. And for some of you, you're actually getting to this point and you're kind of like, when's the next episode? I'm very interested to hear what you have to say.

Dane: [31:22]
And I think that's great news. And we'll be back, Lickety Split, with that.

Mitch: [31:27]
Yeah. So, I can't think of a better pitch for next week than that. So, I will see you in the next episode. Thanks, Dane.

Dane: [31:35]
Thanks, Mitch.

Mitch: [31:36]
Bye.

Dane: [31:36]
Men and women of discomfort is our membership community and we are open to everyone but keep in mind our tagline is it's probably not for you if we're wrong about that or if you want to find out for yourself you can find us at mwod.io the information and material that we're sharing both of this podcast or anything connected to men or women of discomfort or flying s incorporated it's all for general information purposes only Only you should not rely on this material or information on this podcast as a basis for making any kind of decision.

Dane: [32:01]
We do our best to keep everything up to date and correct, and we do a lot of due diligence, but the responsibility is on you to make sure that you're in sync with your own medical professionals that you wouldn't see what we're offering here as somehow a warranty or representation in any kind expressed or implied about this being complete, accurate, reliable, suitable, or comprehensive in any kind of way.

Dane: [32:15]
It's critical you own your agency, which is at the heart of everything we do of Discomfort. We invite you to take the input that we're offering and consider it for yourself. And if it's helpful, please do take advantage of it. But if you do, it's you who is taking the opportunity and we're assuming that you've done your due diligence with it.

Dane: [32:27]
Thanks.